Openstreetmap-carto: Lighten gray color for man-made icons

[jeisenbe]

Related to #1587

Some have complained that hunting stands are too prominent with the current man-made icon color, #555555. Tall towers and cranes in cities can also appear rather too prominent at zoom level 14, where they are one of the only icons shown. It is suggested to change to a slightly lighter gray.

Hunting Shelter, z19

Honolulu, z14 - 4 towers
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/21.3049/202.1434

Hunting Shelters https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/47.8931/16.1289

Ala-Wai Park - stadium lights
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/21.28711/202.17081

Diamond Head Lighthouse*
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/21.2574/202.1878

Mauna Kea Telescopes

[jeisenbe]

Three lighter gray options. I like option 3 best (#777777)

Honolulu, z14 - 4 towers
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=14/21.3049/202.1434
1) Original, #555=555555

2) Slightly lighter #666666

3) Lighter gray, lucky #777777

4) Even lighter #888888

Ala-Wai Park - stadium lights
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/21.28711/202.17081
1) #555555

2) #666666

3) #777777

4) #888888

Diamond Head Lighthouse*
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/21.2574/202.1878
1) #555555

2) #666666

3) #777777

4) #888888

Mauna Kea Telescopes
1) #555555
Stop me if you've seen this one before...

2) #666666

3) #777777

4) #888888

Hunting Shelters https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/47.8931/16.1289
1) #555555

2) #666666

3) #777777

4) #888888

Here's a hunting shelter in a patch of forest (from the same area as above):
1) 555

2) 666

3) 777

4) 888

[kocio-pl]

I like 777 the most.

[matkoniecz]

I am not convinced that any of given examples really needs fixing.

[kocio-pl]

Are you sure you can recognize this color from black?

[matkoniecz]

Are you sure you can recognize this color from black?

I am not sure why it would be necessary.

[kocio-pl]

I guess man made color is not black to avoid being too heavy. If it looks like black, it's probably too strong.

[Tomasz-W]

I don't have a problem with current man-mage-grey shade, so I wouldn't change anything. But if you need to, I wouln't go any lighter than a #666666

[Adamant36]

I like #666666. Its better then the current color. Also, I agree with @Tomasz-W about not going any lighter than that. Maybe #777777 which looks good on the telescopes but not other things. #888888 is going to light though.

[cepesko]

thanks, jeisenbe, for showing the different examples. For me it's not a matter of having problems rather than wanting to see a map where color saturation fits together and results in a harmonic style.
POIs with little relevance (and height) like hunting_stands should blend in with the other features. and not be overly outstanding. Therefore #666666 or even #777777 would be my favourite for these.
Towers and antennas could keep a stronger gray, maybe in the future depending on their height-tag if too many inner-city roof communication antennas show up.

[kocio-pl]

Roof top towers (with location=roof or location=rooftop), including broadcasting towers are not rendered at all.

[jeisenbe]

I agree that 888888 is too light. 777777 is fine in most places, but it may be too light over train tracks and other very dark areas. For example, this crane in Milan is right over main line tracks, which have a very dark gray outline.

Would 666666 work?

Train station with crane over tracks in Milan
Current z14, #555555

Current z15

Current z16

z14 666666

z15 666666

z16 666666

z14 777777

z15 777777

Port of Venice z17
Current 555

666666

777777

Singapore z14
Current 555

666666

777777

Blauer Kran, Germany, z16
Current 555

666666

777777

[jeisenbe]

I noticed that wayside crosses and man_made=cross are rendered as #000000
(black) instead of man-made icon gray.

Also wind power generator icons are black

Should these be fixed? Do I need to open a new issue?
On Thu, Nov 8, 2018 at 7:14 PM Adamant36 [e-mail] wrote:

Btw, there is an issue which I plan to do a PR for eventually that would
make smaller items like benches be rendered in man made grey. So if its to
light of a grey color it might make smaller poi's like those harder to see.
Especially in residential areas. I suggest either making two different man
made grey colors based on size of thing being rendered, or test benches etc
in the new grey color to make sure they arent harder to see. That being
said, it might be worth waiting for that issue to get done before this one
is dealt with.

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[Tomasz-W]

I noticed that wayside crosses and man_made=cross are rendered as #000000
(black) instead of man-made icon gray.

Also wind power generator icons are black

I'm sure we would left black icons for religion map elements, but the thing to consider is to:

• use blackalso for other things, but then we shoud describe which groups should it include (to have a clear rule for the future)
  or
• move all blacknon-religious icons to man-made-grey

Actually black power generators and cranes fits for me. What about including all default-tall man-made objects in blackcategory? It would include towers, power generators and cranes. I think it would be reasonable as we moved/ added many new things to man-made-grey recently. What do you think?

[jeisenbe]

I think the cranes looked too dark with the black renderings (those I
showed with the png), so I would move wind turbines to man-made-gray.

I can understand about using black for place_of_worship and wayside
shrines/crosses.
On Fri, Nov 9, 2018 at 10:01 PM Tomasz Wójcik [e-mail]
wrote:

I noticed that wayside crosses and man_made=cross are rendered as #000000
(black) instead of man-made icon gray.

Also wind power generator icons are black

I'm sure we would left black icons for religion map elements, but the
thing to consider is to:

• use black also for other things, but then we shoud describe which
  groups should it include (to have a clear rule for the future)
  or
• move all black non-religious icons to man-made-grey

Actually black power generators and cranes fits for me. What about
including all naturally tall man-made objects in black category? It would
include towers, power generators and cranes. I think it would be reasonable
as we moved/ added many new things to man-made-grey recently. What do you
think?

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[cepesko]

In general it's a good idea to try to categorize different types of POIs depending on their tagging as man-made, place of worship (...) with one same colour.
However it's well-known that these tagging schemes developed over time and POIs often don't fit in their categories (e.g. wayside_cross = historic vs. place of_worship vs. man_made).
Therefore trying to strongly keep a consistency with tagging categories sometimes doesn't represent real categories.
Example 1: The "amenity" hunting_stand is an amenity for a very limited number of persons, mostly just one, its owner. Aditionally it's not a landmark like the bell_tower of a church. I would therefore give it a light grey.
Example 2: A lighthouse is a big solitary landmark and would get a stronger man_made_grey since more people use it for orientation.
Example 3: A wind_generator very often is part of a wind_farm and, although it is tall, shouldn't dominate the map and would get a lighter man_made_grey.
Importance should play the most important role and change saturation of color.

Category colors shouldn't depend on the tagging but the function of the item.
In issue #3483 there's the idea to change the color of shelters at bus stops to public-transport-blue, which I support as it's part of the transport infrastructure.

etc.

Yes, wind turbines, cranes and hunting stands to man-made-gray would be a

[Tomasz-W]

As sometimes some _man-made-grey_ feature looks _black_ (like religious), I think that going down with #666666 might be an improvement.

[Adamant36]

I vote for #666666 for the reason @Tomasz-W stated.

[jeisenbe]

I will try #666666 in the open PR #3516
On Fri, Nov 16, 2018 at 4:53 PM Adamant36 [e-mail] wrote:

I vote for #666666.

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[geostonemarten]

why not add halo ? or specific color contrast on grey element same as railway???

This problem exist for all points and we need change color regulary in case of contrast with sub elements lines or polygones

[kocio-pl]

Resolved by #3516.