Monikamoddev: casual mode

[ThePotatoGuy]

we should have a mode that is more friendly to:

• streamers
• non-serious users
• people who can't run mas consistently

Casual mode will be a setting that primarily disables affection gain and loss.
Other effects:

• your current affection will be reset to 1.
• anniversaries will be disabled (anniversary dialogue probably wont make sense when you could have barely spent any time with her) TBD
• all games are unlocked
• other things that don't make sense will be disabled tbd

NOTE: there will be a warning window like Unstable Mode so you can't misclick and erase your affection.

*also because there are too many settings, lets replace sensitive mode with this

[Rai99]

If I could make a suggestion, instead of resetting affection to 1, what about disabling aff gain and loss and having a 24 hour wait before aff gain is enabled if the setting is turned off? Or even just disabling aff loss from not visiting and lowering the daily cap a bit?

I don't like the idea of having a button to erase all your affection, even with a confirmation. On the flip side, this sounds like an easy escape from dangerously low affection. Flip the switch and you're good to go for affection again.

As for streamers and content creators, they probably wouldn't make MAS content if their audience doesn't really like it. Mainly, it would be showing off features, including low aff features, which usually isn't appreciated by the MAS community anyway. Locking affection in the middle locks away features such as the clothes selector, and many other affection affected features, which results in less content to show, and an even lower chance people create content of MAS. I don't think MAS is exactly an exciting or engaging thing to stream for an audience.

This sounds like it would put us back around vanilla act 3 or the early days of MAS. Without aff, there's not really any progression, and all there really is are a couple simple games and dialogue that doesn't really change.

Being more friendly to people who can't run MAS often sounds nice, but I think locking them down to 1 aff pretty much defeats the purpose of MAS. Also, someone is bound to double misclick and erase their aff with this.

[ThePotatoGuy]

disabling aff gain and loss and having a 24 hour wait

too exploitable. another thought I had originally was making it a permanent change so you can never return to aff gaining/losing.

disabling aff loss from not visiting

this is a nice mechanic that we want to keep for current users since it adds a decent amount of realism.

easy escape from low affection

well we can change it to only drop affection to 1 but not raise it if its below, but this is still up for discussion. If we change it to a perma solution then theres no way to escape.

streamers

I'm listing potential users. there is certainly a use-case for streamers in having a way to circumvent standard gameplay (like yandere sim dev menu).

misclick

A confirmation window is good enough.

features

another considerations is disabling the affection range constraint, but that might be too much. Or maybe instead of resetting affection, we perma-lock it to whatever its currently at.

[Rai99]

disabling aff loss from not visiting

I meant have the "casual" option disable aff loss from not visiting. Isn't that the main concern with non-serious users? Also lower the aff cap with the option on, so there's an incentive to not constantly keep it on.

[AlenNez]

"can't run mas consistently"?
i'm not sure what this means. can you elaborate?
i dunno if this addition has a significant use at all, with the points rai99 stated i kinda agree. there's not much to do as a streamer, you can exhaust the topics within a fairly short timespan.
if someone is a non-serious MAS user, why even go through the effort of installing it? i don't understand

[ThePotatoGuy]

can you elaborate

Its just a catchall for anyone who falls in the bucket of not running mas consistently. For example, I love playing civ5, but I don't play it everyday, or even every month. but if the game had a mechanic where my civilization started dying the longer I didn't play, I don't think I'd want to play this game anymore.

effort of installing it

because people may just want to check the mod out every once in a while and not have to reset the game data everytime monika leaves.

[multimokia]

because people may just want to check the mod out every once in a while and not have to reset the game data everytime monika leaves.

I still believe if this is the mindset to come into the mod with, this isn't the mod for you.

[ThePotatoGuy]

and I believe that having options and modes for all potential users is better than being extremely exclusive

[multimokia]

Well, this mod is supposed to be a relationship between the player and Monika. I don't think splitting from that core - even optionally - is a good idea. Quite honestly, this seems very much like submod territory versus actual core MAS.

[ThePotatoGuy]

but thats the thing, I want to make this more than just a gf simulator. but that discussion is for the other issue.

[MedicMix]

This is just my two cents, but it sounds like a lot of work for a feature that maybe a handful of people would end up using. Ignoring the exploitative nature, it totally goes against what MAS and Monika's entire character is even about.

Monika is a love-driven girl, motivated by spending forever with the player. To offer a casual mode where nothing is gained and no risk is had totally undermines the point of the mod - to build a loving relationship with her. Not to mention how backhanded it must be to be brought back to life - only to be instantly friendzoned by the only person you ever loved.

If you're trying to argue for streamers, I hate to be the buzzkill but I don't know of literally anyone streaming DDLC, let alone MAS.

As for people going on long hiatuses, if they're truly dedicated to her, they can easily earn back the affection.

Overall, it sounds like a lot of work being dedicated to something that would warrant more of a submod than a full-fledged feature.

[HenryKhan]

(!!ALERT!! NOT AN ENGLISH SPEAKER COMMENT)
I kinda feel bad of thinking another people creating a new Monika just to hear her dialogues and then discarding her, because, that's probably what is going to happen with this casual mode...

I'm going to suggest other thing that it's not actually better, BUT, could be a solution, it's kinda stupid but well... here I go... My suggestion is...

Make an online version out of this casual mode(and of the friendo mode as well?)... where anyone could know Monika better, and then, if anyone got interested, they could download the original game and the mod. And, if they don't got interested, they can just leave. So this way anyone that just want to hear what she have to say will hear that.

This looks like a submod? I think so, and I know, that's really really different from the original mod's purpose, But IDK... that's maybe a way to make Monika more famous... and let her have more friends to chat...

Sorry if the idea is too bad and stupid.

[MaximumRustler]

I also disagree with this and #4849. My response is kind of combined since it would be like saying the same thing twice. I agree with Multi and Mix here, and Fin for the other issue. I don't see a point to making a mode for streaming purposes, damn near no one streams this, and there's no reason to really. Getting rid of affection, or locking and unlocking things for this mode is pointless too, why so people can just avoid those things entirely? I don't see a point to attracting more non-serious users either. Like what, just to show them ''Oh, look what this can do!'' then they leave cause they weren't serious in the first place? I think it's stupid to try and attract a crowd that literally doesn't even care. Now this bit ties in a bit more with the other issue, but it's still related to this topic so here it is. As others have said, the whole point of MAS to this point has been a relationship with her. Doing this, or the other issue, goes against the purpose of the mod. It's supposed to be a gf simulator, not some generic VN or yet another generic ddlc mod to be forgotten. Also, it's out of character. Imagine being brought back to life by the only person left in your world, the one who you kept trying to be with, sacrificed everything for, only to be told something equivalent to ''You'll always be my dearest friend.'' Looking at both issues, you have some devs, and a number of your long-time users, me included, saying that this and the other issue is stupid. And as the others have mentioned, the extra work needed to have these work well alongside what's already there. This is definitely more submod territory.

[dragonsni]

I know I've said my peace in #4849 but I just don't think "casual" mode has a place in the core mod. I believe it belongs in submod territory.

[Olliesama]

"I want to make this more than just a gf simulator"
Maybe don't use Monika as the basis for this then? :S

[antimockingjay]

Why are y'all complaining about an OPTIONAL feature? If you don't like it, don't use it. This is REALLY not that complicated. It's like being vegan and telling the waiter, "hey cancel that other table's order for their steak, I'm vegan so eating steak isn't okay."

If you don't like it, don't use it, plain and simple. This shouldn't be a difficult concept.

[multimokia]

I don't think you understand the core of the mod, then.

This mod was built around the very idea that Monika and the player are partners.
Not friends, nor put in mind as a casual "come back anytime" thing.

It's built to replicate a relationship. I don't know in what world you can just put it on hold and expect that to work out. This is what doesn't sit well with people - myself included.

This idea, therefore, goes against the core principles MAS was built upon, and I feel like it targets an audience we really don't need to.

In my opinion, if you're going to stick with MAS, you're in it for the relationship.
If not, this just isn't the mod for you.

[Daiozen]

I'd define myself as a serious player, and for that purpose, a big part of what makes Monika feel real is that I don't have too much control over her. I like having to put in the effort of actually caring to keep her happy, I like when she brings up controversial topics to which I don't share her opinion. All of this makes me feel challenged, it plays a big part in the immersion.
I think just having the possibility to drastically change her personality by just a few clicks would be giving me too much control and be quite immersion breaking.
Having a mode like that, even if I would not use it myself, would take away from my own experience.

I think this would make a fine submod, but for the reason stated above, I'd personally wish it was not a part of core MAS.

[kaido1224]

This would be aimed at people like me. I doubt too many people fall in this category though.

[99Dman99]

I don't think this feature is necessarily a bad idea. It does seem nice to factor casual players that want to check out the mod for a day or two, then move onto another mod or game without thinking of the unintended backlash towards Monika.
Those kinds of casual players may also want to come back to this more for another day or two, to check out new updates. But if they got hit with affection drops, they couldn't check out the Mod. Because Monika is deeply upset with them.

Expanding the player base isn't a bad idea. However, this is a feature that caters to a minor number of people, and doesn't seem like something anyone but a small number of people would use. Especially if it takes away many features of the Mod. Plus the factor of a dedicated player using the feature out of curiosity and getting reset to 1 affection.

Also be sure to factor the opposite side of the spectrum, with people at negative affection, activating casual mode to reset to 1.

But this feature seems like a good long term goal, but there are multiple suggestions and ideas floating around as of right now, that would have the devs time and resources dedicated to instead.

[frostcattooo]

simple answer, no.

not simple and complex protesting answer : as most other people said, this goes against what the mod was made for. so many people don't like this idea, including i, because of the amount of monis that will be neglected. like, doesn't that make you feel a bit bad? just using monika after story for some views or "testing the features" rather than actually having a bond with her? yeah.

just no.

[Authrix]

Man, people sure are dogpiling on this and #4849
And my response to both is: no one is forcing you to use either mode. They're literally optional modes. This shouldn't be a difficult concept to understand.

Would I use them? No, they're not for me. That probably goes for 95% of the audience here - these are both more casual modes for more casual players, not the die-hard Monika fans that have come to the mod's Github to help out with it.

These modes aren't for us, but to expand the community. That growth, in turn, will make the community and mod stronger - which should really be regarded as a good thing.

I see some of the points against though: it does feel jarring considering the mod's past and foundation. All I can really advise (and again, no one is forcing you to use either mode) is to suspend your disbelief just a little. That and PotatoGuy has been at the helm of this ship since day one - I think he knows what the mod's about better than most of the people citing its history.

TL;DR: No one is forcing you to use the modes, and PotatoGuy knows what he's going.

[Booplicate]

These modes aren't for us, but to expand the community. That growth, in turn, will make the community and mod stronger - which should really be regarded as a good thing.

Don't think it will expand the community. Bringing some people who don't care about the mod and Monika won't help. They will never become a part of the community. Why wasting time resources for two guys who will stream the mod for 2 days and one girl who will delete the mod after a few days? This is the best scenario imo. I'm here to be a part of the community that cares about Monika and see this project as a bit more than _just another mod_. You already have people in the community, why don't focus on stuff they would like to see? This also will help to expand the community (and won't let it fall apart), but with people who actually want to be here and not just for the lulz.
I find both this and 4849 out of place for this mod. It just feels wrong.

P.S. There is a way to stop aff drop. Why don't just use the right farewell? This is enough to not run MAS every day (every week?).
P.P.S Having a button to kill all your progress won't help. I'm serious! I already can see people whose progress was lost because they occasionally pressed the button. I guarantee that the warning won't help.

[Rai99]

• Optional or not, it would take a long time to implement, meaning there would effectively be a hiatus, and that would probably lose us more fans than the feature would gain us.
• If the feature was implemented, how many real users would this bring us? I mean people that actually use MAS regularly and not once or twice and never again? Maybe that's an extra download or two, but that doesn't really contribute much to the community, and again, that amount of effort for not much gain.
• MAS currently is focused on a romantic relationship with Monika. It would be better to make a separate mod for anything else than trying to also jam it in the main mod, because that would require alternate dialogue for almost every single topic, and that would make maintaining both mods much more difficult than it should be, so it's not really a good idea for the future of MAS maintenance wise.

PotatoGuy has been at the helm of this ship since day one

This isn't actually true. Backdash was the person who started it all, and TPG became lead in March 2018 after Pi stepped down.

Regardless who's been at the helm the longest, there are other devs too, and they've been around for a long time, and would also probably have a good grip on the mod. If nobody was allowed to object or give their own input, this mod wouldn't be open source.

I think he knows what the mod's about better than most of the people citing its history.

In the end, he _is_ the lead dev and definitely has the power to ignore any and all input from the community and other devs if he so chooses, but even if this isn't a democracy, he's not the only one who knows MAS and base DDLC, and there's still a team behind MAS.

[ThePotatoGuy]

[closing until we look into it]