Computer-science: Please help to Evaluate "Computer programming for everyone" on Futurelearn to replace py4e in "Intro CS"

[krishnakumarg1984]

The "Intro to CS" section currently recommends "Python for Everybody", which I have taken. Py4e is a fairly long course, which sorts of eats into your time in advancing through the curriculum, which can sap one's motivation especially at such an early stage (before any real CS is undertaken).

I am proposing an evaluation of an alternative: FutureLearn's Computer Programming for Everyone, which might be a decent replacement, and help to keep the motivation levels high by moving faster through the curriculum. Having taken FutureLearn's pre-calculus course myself (an OSSU prerequisite), I wish to reaffirm that their catalogue contains material that is nothing to be scoffed at.

Can the moderators take a look, and offer your thoughts on whether it is worth replacing py4e as the intro course?

[Alaharon123]

This is actually the same course as the one we currently use as stated at https://www.py4e.com . The questions to ask are whether we need all five Coursera courses in the curriculum and, if we only need the first one or two, which of the four websites should be the primary one linked

[krishnakumarg1984]

@Alaharon123 Not at all. This is a different put together by the Institute of Coding and hosted on FutureLearn.

Please have a look here. Computer Programming for Everyone. It has no connection with Py4E.

[Alaharon123]

Oh my bad, I misread it as Python for Everybody, which is also on FutureLearn

[Alaharon123]

Taking a glance, it appears to use Scratch or something similar. The primary purpose of Intro Programming is to have something that teaches Python slower than Intro CS so people who've never touched a programming language don't get left behind by the fast pace of the Intro CS course. I don't think Programming for Everyone meets that goal. However if the problem is how long Py4e is, it could be worth cutting down on how much of it we include as an alternate solution to that problem. Do you think Programming for Everyone would be a better solution? Make a case for it.

[krishnakumarg1984]

I have taken "py4e" and it took me a fairly long time to finish all 5 courses about 1.5 months)

I don't want to get into a "Language A" vs "Language B" discussion, but before the intro CS stage, does it matter that they use scratch, as long as the concepts of programming are covered. If using scratch was a demerit, then PL A,B & C shouldn't be in the curriculum since these courses use "RacketML" I believe?

The institute of coding has received tremendous attention in the UK these days, and they have been registering/enrolling attendees by the droves. The course is only 2 weeks long, and might help to keep the motivation levels for new beginners.

Can we recommend this as an "alt"? OSSU caters to a much wider audience spanning the entire spectrum ranging from:

• full-time CS students who regularly use the curriculum over 3-4 years to augment concepts taught at their local universities,

all the way to

• single parents with non-technical backgrounds (maybe furloughed or otherwise out of jobs), looking to learn CS skills on a part-time basis juggling life and family (in extreme cases)

and everything in between.

Including a shorter "alt" course for those pressed for time (especially if we meet the CS2013 curriculum standards) could be worth considering.

[StevenKJo]

PY4E and CS50 are the best courses for Software Development Fundamentals available right now, so PY4E should not be removed from the curriculum, however I agree with you, py4e its a long course for an introductory course "Approx. 8 months to complete" according to coursera.

New students should not have to spend eight months just to decide if CS its right for them. Computing Programming for Everyone that you recommended lowers the bar of skill for a student to start because its pretty short and simple, like CS50s week 0 Scratch. I think CS50's Understanding Technology satisfies the same objective, its CS50 prequel and its a bit more complete. An easy course that achieves a "Trailer-Movie" relationship between Intro-Core would be more valuable for new students, specially because OSSU its an online curriculum and it doesn't have the physical presence commitment of students.

I think Py4E should stay in the course, but it can just be moved to core programming, because its actually a way better course than the How To Code series, and the intro course should only be CS50's Understanding Technology.

Thanks to this issue i adjusted my curriculum draft, if i started the curriculum again i would have done it like this. My draft of comment-660886018

---

Intro CS

| KA | Course | Hours| Prerequisites |
|---|---|---|---|
| SDF - Software Development Fundamentals|CS50's Understanding Technology | 24 | none

Core CS

Theory

Develop effective ways to solve computing problems.

| Knowledge Area | Course | Hrs | Prerequisites |
|---|---|---|---|
| SDF - Software Development Fundamentals| Python for Everbody & CS50 | 244 | none
| SP - Social and Professional Practice| Learning How to Learn | 15 | none
| DS - Discrete Structures| ¹ Calculus A B C, Probab. & CS Math | 420 | high school
| PL - Programming Languages| Pogramming Languages A B C| 66 | SDF
| AL - Algorithms and Complexity | Algorithms | 96 | SDF PL DS
| CN - Computational Science | Computer Science | 80 |DS AL

[krishnakumarg1984]

Before we amend the curriculum, it would be nice if someone can take the FutureLearn programming course and offer some feedback.

[rayhendricks]

I signed up for the precancerous course but they want you to pay to take tests. This is kinda annoying so yes I do agree that khan academy math 1-3 is better as ray is free

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On Sep 15, 2020, at 7:04 PM, Krishnakumar Gopalakrishnan, PhD [e-mail] wrote:


errr... before we amend the curriculum, shouldn't someone take the FutureLearn programming course, and offer some feedback?

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[krishnakumarg1984]

@rayhendricks Please stay on topic when commenting

What do you mean by "precancerous" course? This issue is not about any math course, but about "introduction to programming".

[waciumawanjohi]

I think it may have been an auto-correct of pre-calculus, which would make sense with the reference to Khan Academy's Math 1-3. (And the original message referred to FutureLearn's precal course)

[krishnakumarg1984]

@waciumawanjohi Which original message are you referring to? This issue specifically deals with evaluating an alternative 'Intro to programming' course from the institute of coding, and has nothing to do with Maths. Maths & pre-calculus related discussions may happen elsewhere outside of this issue.

[waciumawanjohi]

In your first message above you wrote

Having taken FutureLearn's pre-calculus course myself (an OSSU prerequisite)
, I wish to reaffirm that their catalogue contains material that is nothing to be scoffed at.

I think that's what the other contributor was responding to. Hopefully he will return and either explain or move the comment to the proper issue.

[rachel83az]

Before we amend the curriculum, it would be nice if someone can take the FutureLearn programming course and offer some feedback.

I've had this in my "todo list" at FutureLearn for a while. The "first week" tells you what computers do and introduces you to the concept of what a program is without introducing any code.

Week 2 starts by introducing you to https://blockly.games/ You are instructed to do Maze first, then Turtle.

It then moves on to discuss programming as part of a team (a very basic overview), skills that employers are looking for (again, very basic), more teamwork, career advice, finished.

The test at the end does not cost money to do. It is vaguely useful, but not overly so. It took me about 15 minutes to go through the course (not counting Blockly - I already did this in my uni course). I imagine it would only take a day or two for someone completely ignorant of computer programming to finish. I am not sure that this adds value to the OSSU curriculum.

[krishnakumarg1984]

Thank you for your feedback on the course. It appears that this is not worth inclusion into OSSU.

[StevenKJo]

@krishnakumarg1984 you are right in the amount of time Intro CS takes right now, longer courses can be moved to Core CS. What do you think about the CS50's Understanding Technology ?

Proposed Intro CS:

|Total Hours|24|
|---|---|
| CS50's Understanding Tech. alt | 24 |

Current Intro to CS:
|Total Hours|261|
|---|---|
| Python for Everbody | 102 |
| Intro to CS and Programming | 135|
|Missing Semester| 24|

[krishnakumarg1984]

Missing semester is definitely not an intro to CS. It's an intro to practical IT tools of the trade which serve as an adjunct career companion for a programmer or a sysadmin. Perhaps we need to invent a suitable title in the curriculum to place it under.

I haven't taken CS50, but the past comments here in the issues of this repo suggests a mixed view.

[StevenKJo]

@krishnakumarg1984 its not CS50 that takes 144 hours to complete, its CS50's Understanding Technology that takes 24 hours to complete. Its the short and simple prequel that people can course it like a trailer before watching a movie, prior to committing to the full curriculum.

[krishnakumarg1984]

I see. At about 3 hours/week effort, it will take 8 weeks (2 months). Maybe that's reasonable. If the content is exciting to a beginner, probably that's enough to keep them engaged.

I am a beginning student of OSSU. I haven't taken CS50's understanding technology. If others have taken it and it's deemed good, and 2 months seem appropriate, then maybe it's a good choice.

[rachel83az]

CS50 - understanding technology:

1. Hardware Video is about 1 hour long. Covers binary, basics of ASCII, basics of hardware. 1st assignment asks you to do things like explain the different types of memory, convert binary, know what a USB device is.
2. Internet Video is just over 50 minutes long. Basics of what the internet means. Assignment asks you to explain what certain IP addresses mean, describe difference between access points, firewalls, etc. Define DCHP/DNS/IP address/packet. http vs https.
3. Multimedia Video is 40 minutes long. What are file formats? Difference between different file formats. What "bits" mean in graphical formats. How videos work.
4. Security Video is over an hour long. Cookies. Password security. Why certain passwords are insecure. VPNs.
5. Web development Video is over an hour long. HTML vs. CSS. Assignment asks you to create a basic website at repl.it.
6. Programming Video is over an hour long. Assignment is to create a very basic Scratch program/video/animation/game at https://scratch.mit.edu/ using https://scratch.mit.edu/ideas as a resource.

[waciumawanjohi]

From this comment, it seems like the original poster is satisfied that the issue that was opened has been addressed. Closing this issue. Users are welcome to continue discussion of anything else that they desire in this thread. If there is desire for some other change to the curriculum, feel free to open a new issue.