Cataclysm-dda: Soup portions after nutrition update

[ynemo]

Base Soups recipes now produce only 1 portion. Why? I suppose it's mistake.
Before nutrition update, it was 4 portion per 1 base soup recipe.

[ynemo]

just in case, 4 portions of soups = 0.25 L (was before update)

[KorGgenT]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1n1roPzIsRvABg3Ry0q7SPxnUK_C0GR9cjK27m4cF9ok/edit#gid=1724068009

Here are sources from the USDA
also: try crafting them. your calories out will equal your calories in.

[ynemo]

I dont get it.
I just made 0.25 L ( 1 portion? ) of wood soup. 642 kCal.
but according to recipe, it should be 304 kCal
why there are different numbers in recipe and in actual product ?

according to google doc, there are should be 4 charges in this particular wood soup, but i see only 1. After eating it, i confirm, it was only 1 portion of tasty healthy wood soup.

[Barhandar]

Charges represent eating something partially. It doesn't matter that calories in equals calories out, _there needs to be several charges_.

In fact, fractioning nutrition is exactly why the soups have four charges in the first place, they used to have one charge and four times the nutrition, long before calories.

[ynemo]

Also, i found tin can of mushroom soup.
0.25L and 4 Portions.

As i mentioned before, crafted soup has only 1 portion in 0.25 L

[ynemo]

And here is our soup calories champion.
The chicken noodle soup.
0,25 L, 1 portion, 61 kcal.

what a mess?

[KorGgenT]

Charges represent eating something partially. It doesn't matter that calories in equals calories out, _there needs to be several charges_.

In fact, fractioning nutrition is exactly why the soups have four charges in the first place, they used to have one charge and four times the nutrition, long before calories.

What's the point of having four charges each with 15 kcal? do you really want that?
Looks like there's some issue with spawning too many charges in a tin can.

[ynemo]

soups were really comforting food product, U could take 1 thermos with 12 portions of nice hot soup and it was enough for a long day of lonely survival. If u have some traits which reduce ur nutrition need, having a lot of portions could be useful. Also, 8 quench per portion is 32 quench per 0.25L, so soups were good for ur thirst, So u dont need to take a lot of food with u, just little drinks and container with soup was enough.

But i dont get, why there are different numbers in recipe page (304 kcal for wood soup), and 642 kcal in plastic bottle?

[KorGgenT]

But i dont get, why there are different numbers in recipe page (304 kcal for wood soup), and 642 kcal in plastic bottle?

That would be the recent recipe inheritance stuff I put in.
now, whenever you craft a food, it actually gives you the calories based on the ingredients you put in, rather than the direct number in the json.

[ynemo]

i see, i suggest give all soups 32 quenching quality.

[Barhandar]

What's the point of having four charges each with 15 kcal? do you really want that?

If it has quench to back it up, yes. And 150-ish kcal per portion of woods soup.

[KorGgenT]

What's the point of having four charges each with 15 kcal? do you really want that?

If it has quench to back it up, yes. And 150-ish kcal per portion of woods soup.

you're not gonna get 150 kcal in 1/4 cup of soup.
most soup serving sizes are 1 bowl, which is 2 cups. i'm sorry you have to find out this way, but this is a volume nerf. I agree with reassessing quench values, however.

[Barhandar]

you're not gonna get 150 kcal in 1/4 cup of soup.

And yet woods soup gets 642 kcal in 1 cup of soup, which means 160.5 kcal in 1/4 cup.

This isn't a volume nerf. This is you _blatantly not understanding why the old values were there, yet interfering with them_.

most soup serving sizes are 1 bowl, which is 2 cups.

Who the FUCK eats soup in half a liter volumes?

P.S. Chicken _broth_, i.e. with nothing else, is 86 kcal/250ml.

[ynemo]

Who the FUCK eats soup in half a liter volumes?

well, irl soup portion is about 0.3L

[Barhandar]

Actual soup _plate_ is 250ml exactly, and I often eat it partially. Also, your argument is erroneous in the first place - that portioning doesn't apply to low-kcal food doesn't mean that it shan't apply to high-kcal food either, i.e. it's perfectly possible to have chicken soup at 1 charge with high quench and all the actual soups at 2-4 charges to maintain approximate 150-200 kcal per portion.

[int-ua]

I feel the urge to remind everyone that the nutrition rebalance was quite big change in a big system. Some problems and debatable decisions were almost unavoidable. Being more pollite and respectful to authors may yield better results in a collaborative project that CDDA is.

[FuelType-Memes]

I feel the urge to remind everyone that the nutrition rebalance was quite big change in a big system. Some problems and debatable decisions were almost unavoidable. Being more pollite and respectful to authors may yield better results in a collaborative project that CDDA is.

Paraphrasing my ex-senior: Big changes in a big system require big testing

@KorGgenT is awesome for even tackling the problem of 10kcal of starting ingredients somehow becoming a 1000kcal dish, but I feel some sympathy for people being frustrated. Old system followed the logic of: "Ahha, the recipe says I will get 4 0.25L portions with 123kcal each", but the new system is obscure so you just don't know what to expect. And in a game where you need to manage limited resources so tightly (esp in the beginning) that's painful

[moxian]

but the new system is obscure so you just don't know what to expect

New system is totally transparent: the sum of calories you put into the recipe is exactly the calories you get in your resulting dish.
The confusion stems from the fact that it's different from what everyone is used to, and that the caloric values shown in the crafting screen are fixed (as in, do not depend on which ingredients you choose) and often different from the ones you get by cooking the dish with the specific ingredients at hand.

[Marrim]

Er... what? You don't get any added nutrition from cooking the food anymore?
That's weird. You can't equate eating raw grains with eating bread made from them. If such a thing were to be implemented, there should be some kind of "efficiency" factor for dishes, representing that some of them are hard to digest and thus you only get part of their caloric value if you eat them without cooking.

[kevingranade]

Fixed by #27925