Arctos: West Indies = Continent?

[Jegelewicz]

See https://github.com/ArctosDB/arctos/issues/1291#issuecomment-677929819

Also see documentation.

I think this needs to be fixed pretty quickly, but that's just my opinion.

[campmlc]

I agree with moving this to North America.

On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 4:27 PM Teresa Mayfield-Meyer <
[email protected]> wrote:

• [EXTERNAL]*

See #1291 (comment)
https://github.com/ArctosDB/arctos/issues/1291#issuecomment-677929819

Also see documentation
https://handbook.arctosdb.org/documentation/higher-geography.html#continent--ocean
.

I think this needs to be fixed pretty quickly, but that's just my opinion.

[image: image]
https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/5725767/90831962-087beb00-e302-11ea-8cb8-49fba89c9dc1.png

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[dustymc]

North America.

Can we keep greenland too?

[tucotuco]

And Hawaii in North America? Really? From wikipedia, "Hawaii is a state of
the United States of America located in the Pacific Ocean. It is the only
U.S. state located outside North America,..."

On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 12:27 AM dustymc [e-mail] wrote:

North America.

Can we keep greenland too?

[image: Screen Shot 2020-08-20 at 8 22 53 PM]
https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/5720791/90848993-1aba5100-e323-11ea-8880-70a390d5b54a.png

[image: Screen Shot 2020-08-20 at 8 23 28 PM]
https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/5720791/90849001-1ee66e80-e323-11ea-96a6-e2c1e1423c5f.png

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[campmlc]

I thought we were going to trade Puerto Rico for Greenland .. .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Indies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenland

On Thu, Aug 20, 2020 at 10:05 PM John Wieczorek [e-mail]
wrote:

• [EXTERNAL]*

And Hawaii in North America? Really? From wikipedia, "Hawaii is a state of
the United States of America located in the Pacific Ocean. It is the only
U.S. state located outside North America,..."

On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 12:27 AM dustymc [e-mail] wrote:

North America.

Can we keep greenland too?

[image: Screen Shot 2020-08-20 at 8 22 53 PM]
<
https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/5720791/90848993-1aba5100-e323-11ea-8880-70a390d5b54a.png

[image: Screen Shot 2020-08-20 at 8 23 28 PM]
<
https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/5720791/90849001-1ee66e80-e323-11ea-96a6-e2c1e1423c5f.png

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[dustymc]

trade

OK, I'll move Greenland to West Indies....

@tucotuco this is where the "what {geocategory} is {X,Y}?" service would shine. I'm not sure anyone CARES what continent Puerto Rico claims, or if they claim one at all, but we obviously care that they claim something and that it's consistent within and beyond Arctos. (More on that in the other thread....)

[Jegelewicz]

Can we keep greenland too?

We should keep everything we can. Especially stuff where we will be able to grow corn...

[Jegelewicz]

And Hawaii in North America? Really?

Agree - but GBIF treats islands inconsistently. It does seem that they place Hawaii in "Pacific Ocean", but they place South Georgia & South Sandwich Islands in Europe. (We put them in the Atlantic Ocean and GBIF modifies to Europe).

[dustymc]

GBIF modifies to Europe

I fail to see that as anything other than conclusive evidence that GBIF does not (perhaps yet) hold the answer we're looking for.

[Jegelewicz]

Agree, but they are handling our data, so we need to figure out how to play nice with them, even when it seems crazy.

[dustymc]

even when it seems crazy.

No....

[sharpphyl]

I really don't care how crazy GBIF's continents are as long as my records don't disappear because we use a different set of continents than they do and we don't have a field for water bodies. This issue is essentially the same as in #128 (https://github.com/tdwg/dwc-qa/issues/128) which goes back to 2018 and #1921 (https://github.com/ArctosDB/arctos/issues/1291) and related to #2876.

If some collections want to stay with the current setup (which would probably be fine for terrestrial specimens) can we develop an alternative group of higher geography that is GBIF (DwC?) compliant for those of us who want our specimens to be found on a continent or water body search - similar to the alternatives we have for taxonomy?

[campmlc]

I agree with Phyllis that we need our records to be searchable on GBIF,
whatever that requires. Maybe we have an Arctos continent field and then a
separate "Continent as mapped to GBIF" field.

On Fri, Aug 21, 2020 at 10:54 AM Phyllis Sharp [e-mail]
wrote:

• [EXTERNAL]*

I really don't care how crazy GBIF's continents are as long as my records
don't disappear because we use a different set of continents than they do
and we don't have a field for water bodies. This issue is essentially the
same as in #128 https://github.com/ArctosDB/arctos/issues/128 (
tdwg/dwc-qa#128 https://github.com/tdwg/dwc-qa/issues/128) which goes
back to 2018 and #1921 https://github.com/ArctosDB/arctos/issues/1921 (

1291 https://github.com/ArctosDB/arctos/issues/1291) and related to

2876 https://github.com/ArctosDB/arctos/issues/2876.

If some collections want to stay with the current setup (which would
probably be fine for terrestrial specimens) can we develop an alternative
group of higher geography that is GBIF (DwC?) compliant for those of us who
want our specimens to be found on a continent or water body search -
similar to the alternatives we have for taxonomy?

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[dustymc]

whatever that requires

I'd say it requires working with GBIF to find an agreeable solution.

Continent as mapped to GBIF

You could work that out with VertNet, or manipulate your own data before passing it on to GBIF.

[tucotuco]

Hi folks, rather than rehash what I think are the issues with how GBIF interprets continent, I urge you to read the issue I presented to them, as it will explain a lot about why you see what you see in GBIF.